Bucking The Mainstream System

Do you ever question the mainstream narrative about health, food, and the government? When you do, what do you do? Do you go with your gut or with the public agenda? What if you disagree with where it’s moving you? How do you resist?

The late Ronnie Cummins explains how to buck the system on multiple levels. Ronnie is the founder and former director of the Organic Consumers Association (OCA), a long-time activist, protestor, and author. Ronnie passed away in April of 2023, but in May 2022, he shared his take on the state of world affairs, the importance of local, organic food, and how to live healthily in this contaminated world. Ronnie wasn’t just referring to toxins in our physical environment, but also in over-reaching government, pharmaceutical companies, and leaders who collaborate to further their own interests in place of the interests of humanity. Ronnie offers insights today on how to buck the system and escape the mainstream ideological paradigm.

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Episode Transcript

Within the below transcript the bolded text is Hilda Labrada Gore and the regular text is Ronnie Cummins.

Do you ever question the mainstream narrative about health, food, and the government? When you do, what do you do? Do you go with your gut or with the public agenda? This is episode 432. Our guest is the late truth seeker Ronnie Cummins. Ronnie is a longtime activist, protestor, and author. He has fought hard for decades for individual rights and food freedom. He is also the Founder and Director of the Organic Consumers Association. Ronnie passed away in April 2023, but I had the privilege of connecting with him in Mexico in May 2022.

Now, we publish this interview with great respect for the man who speaks his mind unreservedly. You’ll know Ronnie’s take on our current state of world affairs in this conversation. He also covers the importance of local organic food, proper food sourcing, and how to live healthily in this contaminated world. When I say contaminated, let me just say that Ronnie doesn’t simply discuss toxins found in adjuvants and shots, for example, but he also gets into the general environment in which we live with an overreaching government, Big Pharmaceutical companies, and a clandestine network of world leaders who do not have our best interests in mind.

To put it mildly, Ronnie also explains why he moved out of the US in part to escape the mainstream ideological paradigm. Before we dive into the conversation, I want to let you know that our show is gaining an audience like a snowball rolling down the mountainside. Not that a snowball gains an audience, but bear with me. We are growing. That’s what I’m getting at.

I want to thank you for tuning in and sharing the show with your friends. Honestly, word of mouth is the best way to spread the good stuff around. Keep it up. Tell a friend about the Wise Traditions Show. Share a link of a favorite episode by email or text it to a friend. Keep letting people know that we’re putting out content that promotes a healthy lifestyle and Wise Traditions style. Thank you so much.

Oh, and please note that a few times in this episode, Ronnie refers to the virus as being engineered and transmittable. Keep in mind that the WAPF is not in agreement with him on this matter. The Weston A. Price Foundation believes that no virus is responsible for any illness.

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Welcome to the show, Ronnie.

Good to be with you.

I’m so glad to be here. I find it so surprising to meet you in San Miguel de Allende. How long have you been living down here?

We’ve had a project for a couple of years here in San Miguel, an organic regenerative research farm and then we’ve got an activist network. We have offices in Mexico City as well as a network of readers and supporters around Mexico.

Did you start the Organic Consumers Association in Mexico or everywhere?

We started in the US in 1998 and we grew pretty large so that we were able to raise enough money to set up international offices and start doing international work. We subsidized a lot of the international work of Regeneration International and Via Orgánica, the network here in Mexico.

What is the purpose of the Organic Consumers Association?

We’re set up to promote organic and regenerative food and farming, protect organic standards, and bring together the natural health movement and the food movement, other movements, like the climate movement and peace movement together. We believe that you need both natural health and organic food nowadays to be healthy.

You need both natural and organic food nowadays to be healthy.

You have Via Orgánica, the Organic Consumers Association, and regenerative agriculture group. I feel like you have your finger in so many pies. What motivated you to write this book with Mercola, The Truth About COVID-19?

A lot of us, when COVID first hit the headlines, didn’t know exactly what was happening, but very quickly, it became clear that we were being lied to. Some of us started digging and talking to people who were experts in biological weapons and government fear-mongering. We started putting the pieces together. It was about February 2020, two months after the media started talking about this and people were getting into a panic that we started to realize that the whole official narrative, the origins, the nature of this disease, the virulence of this disease, the way you should prevent it and treat it, everything we were hearing in the mass media was propaganda, not based on fact.

What was the first thing that raised a red flag in your mind?

The first thing to me was that the media said this was coming from a wet market or the barbaric practice of eating bushmeat or whatever. When you start to realize, “There’s a bioweapons lab right in Wuhan.” They say they’re doing this for medical reasons to develop vaccines but the Wuhan Lab is funded by the Chinese military, the US military, the US National Institutes of Health, and the Chinese Centers for Disease Control. The more you looked at it, it was like, “The bats are hundreds of miles away. They hibernate that time of year. These were not bats that flew into Wuhan.”

It became clear that the Chinese government checked the seafood market near where a lot of the early cases were reported and they didn’t sell bats or bushmeat there. The government admitted right away, “We tested the market and we couldn’t find any of the virus except in the sewage. We didn’t find it in any of the animals.”

There had been some early articles. One of the things I do is monitor the alternative press because I’m the content editor for Organic Consumers Association Newsletter, Organic Bytes. We’ve got about five different websites and lots of social media. I saw right away that there were articles where Chinese scientists were saying, “This started from the lab.” These scientists were shut up, disappeared, and jailed. If people act like they’re guilty, you want to look a little further.

We couldn’t figure out why is the US even more anxious than the Chinese Communist Party to cover this up. In a little research, we saw that Fauci and the National Institutes of Health had been funding dangerous lab experiments in Wuhan weaponizing or increasing the virulence of viruses because it was prohibited in the United States starting in 2014 under Obama for three years.

WT 432 | Bucking The Mainstream System — Bucking The Mainstream System: The National Institutes of Health had been funding dangerous lab experiments in Wuhan weaponizing, or increasing the virulence of viruses, because it was prohibited in the United States starting in 2014 under Obama for three years.

The reason it was prohibited for three years, at least partially in the US, was because there had been a lot of publicity around these horrific experiments going on funded by Bill Gates and Fauci. One of them was at the University of Wisconsin, weaponizing the bird flu with Spanish influenza. Others at Erasmus University in the Netherlands, where took the virulent flu and made them aerosolized where they traveled through the air.

Immediately, I was censored. I used to write for ten different “progressive magazines” besides Organic Bytes. All of a sudden, they wouldn’t print my articles when I started talking about the overwhelming evidence pointed to a lab release in Wuhan. Hopefully, it was accidental and it wasn’t the US military releasing the virus near the Wuhan lab because they knew China would get involved. At that point, when the US was pointing out, “Looks like this is the Chinese,” then the Chinese were saying, “No. the US released this during the World Military Games in October of 2019 when all these athletes went back to their home countries and were sick.”

There was a lot of mutual finger-pointing. You were saying that some of these Chinese scientists were saying, “There’s something wrong here. This does look like it was a release from a lab.” They were either jailed or silenced. I was wondering why hasn’t the same thing happened to you. I guess on a small level, it has been. You’ve been censored from different platforms.

I’ve been an activist for half a century. I have a large readership, not just from Organic Bytes, but all the other websites and magazines I would write for. They stopped printing the stuff and they fell into this COVID panic themselves. Anything you said, they counter the official narrative. You must be a Trumper. I literally had people say, “Ronnie, have you become a Trumper?” My answer was, “Have you become an idiot? Do you look at evidence anymore? Do you read the New York Times and the Washington Post?”

It became clear it was being orchestrated. You start looking at the statistics like they were calling cases. Typically, a case in medical tradition is when you’re actually infectious and you can spread disease. They were saying a case means using a PCR test, which has some validity. Even the inventors of the PCR test say it doesn’t diagnose illness. It gives you indications. If you turn it up too much, you get a lot of false positives. If you turn it way down, you’re going to get false negatives. They were turning it way, way up, far above so they were trying to panic the public.

They were saying that 94% of the deaths CDC reported as COVID deaths. If you looked at the death certificates, this was in August or September of 2020, 94% of them had what they call comorbidities. In other words, the people were in bad health beforehand. Almost everyone who was getting put in the hospital was elderly, obese, or seriously ill.

Why wasn’t the media describing this as a, “This is dangerous biological trigger that can highlight and exacerbate preexisting underlying diseases.” The reason it was so transmittable, whereas bat viruses never were before, was because it had been genetically engineered in a lab. You couldn’t find this anywhere except in the alternative information by Mercola, Children’s Health Defense, OCA, and National Vaccine Information Center. There were people reporting on this but no one was covering it. We decided we’d keep on. We lost thousands and thousands of subscribers, but we also gained thousands and thousands of subscribers.

People who are willing to question the mainstream narrative and I’m so grateful that you and your groups have been. We, at the Weston A. Price Foundation also have questioned it. Because we care about health, we wanted to go in-depth on, as you’ve said, not just the source of this. Although we aren’t sure it’s a virus at all but that’s another story. We also question the lack of alternative treatments. We know that that’s so they could use the emergency use vaccine. Now I’m saying too much. I’m sorry. I don’t mean to talk so much.

The point I’m trying to get at is, Ronnie, I want to pivot from its questionable origins and why treatments were set aside because our audience tends to know a lot of those answers to what the future holds in terms of the four subtitles of the book. You have information on The Great Reset, lockdowns, vaccine passports, and the new normal. I want you to talk to us about what The Great Reset is if you see more lockdowns in the future and vaccine passports and if we’re headed to the new normal that Bill Gates and others have said we are headed to. Let’s talk about the Great Reset first. Who’s behind that?

I had always been a student of history and I was very interested. When I was young, John F. Kennedy was killed. Most people thought that it was a pretty fishy official story. His brother, who had been Attorney General under Kennedy, who was running for president in ‘68, would’ve won. He knew what was going on. He was killed. Martin Luther King was killed about the same time. After all these incidents, the majority of the public was suspicious about the official story. Those of us who actually got deeply into it and talked about it were considered conspiracy theorists.

Also, the 2001 9/11 was also very fishy as were the anthrax attacks that followed shortly thereafter. The two Iraq wars that we got into turned out later we were manipulated into these. We killed a couple of million people for oil claiming it was for democracy and fighting terrorism. During the Vietnam War, they tried to draft me. We were manipulated into the Vietnam War with this so-called Gulf of Tonkin incident.

I was primed to look at this. One of the things I noticed was before the anthrax attacks, there were these war games or planning exercises, Dark Winter, and the same characters keep propping up. You could understand it became very clear in the anthrax attacks that when you got someone like the Head of the Pentagon Rumsfeld, a major stockholder in the vaccine corporation that produces Cipro, that prevent you from dying of anthrax. The government buys up millions of doses of Cipro after the anthrax attacks and injects them into all these soldiers going over to Iraq, who come down with these horrific diseases and so on.

I knew that vaccine profiteers were part of this, but I didn’t understand that the major Silicon Valley internet corporations, for example, Google, Facebook, and Twitter all straight-out small companies, and then the CIA equity investment firm gave them tremendous amounts of money. From the beginning, Silicon Valley, the National Security State, and big pharma have been buddy-buddy in these things. There was published literature going back to 2015 talking about weaponizing these bat viruses to where they’d be really transmissible. University of North Carolina, Ralph Baric, and Shi Zhengli, the lead scientist at Wuhan, published the article about these numerous articles.

It was public knowledge in a way if we just opened our eyes to it.

Yes. What do people think? They were getting funded by the Pentagon, the Chinese military as well as the so-called Public Health Services to do these manipulations. They did them successfully and then all of a sudden there’s an outbreak. After this research, there’s a moratorium in the US but it had been offshored to Wuhan. It was pretty clear.

The outbreak came after these planning exercises where they practically laid out what it would look like when such an outbreak occurred.

Yes like Event 201. This is October 2019, a few months before they would announce the so-called pandemic at that time. It’s like, “Who’s at this war game meeting or planning?” The former head of the CIA, the head of the CDC in China, Bill Gates, executives from big pharma, and executives from Silicon Valley. What was the main thing they discussed? If we have a pandemic, there’s going to be a lot of opposition. How do we control that opposition? How do we censor what they call disinformation? All this became pretty clear.

The Great Reset is simply that the global elite, especially those who are anchored in Silicon Valley, the mass media, big pharma, or the national security state thought they had us where we were so panicked. Otherwise, rational people lost their minds, started putting masks on their kids, and agreed to lockdowns that devastated small businesses and minority businesses that literally killed millions of people around the world.

Why would normally sane people do this? They figured it out. It’s fear. If you create a virus that is scary enough and then manipulate the data around it amongst the populations in the industrialized world that are so damn unhealthy already from poisoned food and a poisoned environment, you have an opportunity to take advantage of that.

Fear and I would also say a gradual incrementation of removal of rights. In other words, people did not think they were going to be locked down for months. They thought, “Two weeks to flatten the curve,” and then those two weeks extended to several months to the point where people lost their livelihoods. As you’ve said, many lost their lives, as well.

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Coming up. Ronnie talks about vaccine safety, the invisible government that rules behind the scenes, and the key things he believes that we can do right now to improve our health.

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The US was so polarized. Trump got 65 million votes, I believe, in 2016, and Hillary got 62 million. These are two of the most unpopular candidates of all time. A lot of people supported Trump because he had the neck for occasionally saying the right thing in a blunt way and creating a persona that he was an anti-establishment and anti-deep state. He mentioned in one of the debates with Bush, for example, early on in the campaign, he said, “Your dad manipulated us into a war in Iraq that cost a trillion dollars and killed a million people. You don’t believe the official story of 9/11, do you?” Trump has a vaccine-injured child, Barron, which some people close to him, and had friends with vaccine-injured children.

After the election, Trump asked Robert Kennedy in the fall of 2016, and he said, “Robert, would you head up a special federal commission investigating vaccine safety?” Robert Kennedy said, “Of course, I’d love to do that.” In January 2017, it was announced that Merck had donated $1 million to the Trump inauguration party. According to Robert Kennedy, he never heard from Trump again.

This is a guy who’s quite capable of sounding like a radical populist of being unafraid of the establishment. He used the term the deep state a lot, which was traditionally only left-wingers talking about the Kennedy assassinations or all the wars we’ve been dragged into. He coined the term the deep state to refer to the fact that we’ve got an invisible government in the US and Western nations that rules behind the scenes.

If you agree to play by the rules, they’ll let you advance up the ladder, but if you deviate, they kill you. Everyone knows that. Obama sounded great on the campaign trail, but when he got in there, he acted just like all the rest. Anyway, the country was so polarized by the time the WHO started trying to panic us. They redefined the definition of a pandemic to where they could claim the early days of COVID-19 were a pandemic when they really weren’t at the time. Those earlier variants were more destructive. It’s more of a biological trigger for underlying.

The World Economic Forum had actually talked openly about this, believing that these are the world economic elite. We’ve got some serious problems that we need to solve. One of those being the climate crisis. Another one being the situation of poverty in the world. The problem is, do you really want the billionaires of the world to define how we’re going to solve these problems? In other words, they stole the rhetoric of a lot of different organization’s campaigners and rolled it all into saying, “We need a great reset.”

We’ve got some serious problems that we need to solve. One of those is the climate crisis. Another one is the situation of poverty in the world.

That sounds good on the surface. I believe we need a great reset, but we don’t want the reset they’re talking about which eliminates freedom and constitutional rights and places censorship ability in the hands of the government and big pharma in the military-industrial. Facebook would not let us promote our newsletter. It’s been a long-standing thing on COVID. They said, “The headline of our newsletter was, ‘The Need to Eliminate Bioweapons and Nuclear Weapons Worldwide.’” That’s forbidden to talk about that. Now you can’t talk about the facts on Ukraine.

It created in America what’s called the Trump Derangement Syndrome, where people who voted against Trump, which was 65 million people at least, hate him so badly that they don’t believe anything he says. When he would occasionally blurt out the right thing like he called COVID-19 or SARS COV 2 the Chinese virus at one point, which is pretty accurate in a way. It did come out of a lab there.

They’re recklessly doing the most dangerous research you can do, not only in Wuhan, but in these subsidiary labs that are called Biosafety Level Number Two. That’s like your dentist’s office. It’s the same level as that. That’s where they were carrying out a bunch of this research. We may blame Wuhan but it could more likely happen in some of these other labs, where they were doing part of the research with no security at all.

We were talking about the polarization in the United States, but I have to say, I feel like because of this situation, people were pushing for their freedom more than I may have ever noticed in my lifetime before. In other words, lockdowns here didn’t last as long as they have in countries like Australia and Canada maybe because people know their rights a little better. I don’t know. You help me understand and wrap my head around what’s going on.

I had to get out of the US. I worked a good part of the time in the far North of Minnesota where OCA has an office and a research firm. Up there in the woods, it was different. Country rural people tended to be very skeptical of all this. If COVID were such a problem, how come there weren’t any cases in our county or the adjoining counties? A lot of the working class people, the loggers, the farmers, the people who worked in the mines up there, they didn’t buy this. I could stand that. I always used to live a good part of the year in Minneapolis but I couldn’t stand it anymore. All the people who had been active for decades all of a sudden lost their minds. They were wearing masks, shaming people, spouting off propaganda, and big pharma.

Now there’s always been a weakness, I believe, in the US that a lot of people don’t know much about food and natural health. This is especially prevalent in people you’d think would know better, the environmentalists, the anti-war people, the people who speak out for justice, gender justice, racial justice, rights for migrants, and so on. Most of these people are pretty illiterate when it comes to natural health, unless they’ve been sick or unless a member of their family’s been really sick. It was a horrible situation where all the people that I knew were willing to go along with what the government said. The people I’d worked with for 30 years, I said, “I’m not talking to you anymore about this.”

There’s always been a weakness in the US that a lot of people don’t know much about food and natural health, and this is especially prevalent among people you’d think would know better.

I spent most of the last two and a half years in Mexico, where the people were panicked in the cities especially and so on, but the government was not behaving. Early on the Mexican government, the president was saying, “This is overblown.” Mexico City did some of the most innovative, preventive, and early treatment of work, and the whole world have setting at these. They set up these kiosks all over Mexico City and free testing for people where they were accurately testing people or trying to.

If you turned out positive, they didn’t say, “Here’s the bus to the concentration camp.” They said, “Here’s a packet of vitamin supplements, Ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, and zinc. How many people are in your family?” They gave you packets for everyone. They said, “If you’ll give us your cell phone, we’ll call you up and remind you to take these and we want to check up on you.” This was phenomenally successful.

Here in Mexico, I buy 50 boxes of Ivermectin every week for people coming back and forth to the US. Ivermectin, you can get it over the counter. Hydroxychloroquine, which is about the same thing as Quercetin, but you can get that. The medical establishment here is under the gun of the WHO in the US so they’re afraid to be too vocal. In general, the President of the country, the Mayor of Mexico City, the Social Security Administration, the Public Health Administration, a lot of them knew, a lot of them didn’t, and a lot of them fell for the line.

I went into exile here in the last two and a half years because I hate what’s happening in the US, but I did keep writing and working about it. I’m glad that it seems to have resided a little bit. I don’t see any people who became COVID death cult members or whatever apologizing for swallowing the wrong information and lying and accepting the censorship.

It’s like life has gotten back to normal. That’s what I wanted to ask you as we start to wrap up. Do you think the new normal is going to be what some of these planners have in mind, or are we going to have a better kind of reset, maybe the kind you were envisioning?

They failed in this first attempt to exert totalitarian control under the guise of democracy and so on. I don’t think they’re giving up. They’re still trying right now with the monkeypox. We wrote, Alexis Baden- Mayer from our staff, about Gates and Fauci and they have been funding the weaponization of bird flu for quite a while. We don’t know for sure but they may have a bird flu right now that can spread readily into humans that has a much higher fatality rate than the SARS COV 2. They have killed 38 million birds and they were going around demanding to build a test. They were used to farmers and they were testing outdoor free-range chickens as well. If they found a positive, who knows how they were setting the PCR test, they’re killing all the people.

What I noticed is that the USDA is announcing that bird flu cases were very low in May. They may have realized either they don’t have a weaponized version perfected yet that can scare the hell out of people or they’ve decided not to release it because there’s too much suspicion. Obviously, this is treason, mass murder, or whatever that they’re carrying out. They might be afraid that they’re all going to end up in prison for the rest of their lives if they don’t look out.

Thank you for your role in getting the truth out. I want to pose to you the question I like to pose at the end, Ronnie. I know we’ve covered a lot of topics. A lot of our audience tune in because they want to improve their health. If the audience could do one thing to improve their health, what would you recommend that they do?

Eat organic and regenerative food that you cook at home. If at all possible, buy from local and regional farmers. We live in such a contaminated environment that for most of us, especially older people, nutritional supplements are very important. Vitamin D, Quercetin, zinc, and Vitamin C are very important. I read Dr. Mercola every day. I read Children’s Health Defense. I follow Weston Price. It is very important that we strengthen our immune systems and also that we strengthen our mental health so that we realize this is the battle of our lives.

They’re not going to give up because they think they can win, and we cannot give up. We owe it to our kids and the future generations and ourselves. We can win this thing because the global grassroots and the people of the world do not believe their governments. They do not want billionaire oligarchs, whether they live in Russia, China, the US, or Iran. Everyone feels the same way. We have to translate this anger and latent resistance around the world into real resistance. We’ve got to have positive alternatives.

It is worth investing in better food, growing your own food, educating your kids, and talking to people because they’re not giving up yet. We have to be able to fight off these bio-weaponized diseases as well as the chronic diseases that are now the majority of the population is suffering from. Health, justice, regenerative food, farming, and land use all go together. We just need to keep plugging away.

It is worth investing in better food, growing your own food, educating your kids, and talking to people.

Let’s talk to the people who will listen to us now. We’ll hope that our “liberal progressive friends” who got brainwashed and panicked through this period will wake up because it could get worse. For now, we should all congratulate ourselves on fighting against all odds. We actually held them off. We’ve discredited people like Gates, Fauci, and Big Pharma. People need to understand that the military-industrial complex is right in there. We need to not only ban bio-weapons but ban nuclear weapons. We need peace in the Ukraine and negotiate peace, not escalation. This has got to start spreading all over the world.

Thank you so much for your time. I know I feel inspired to win this thing starting from the grassroots up. Thanks so much, Ronnie.

Thank you. Keep up the good work.

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Our guest was Ronnie Cummins. You can visit the Organic Consumers Association for blog posts and resources. I’m Hilda Labrada Gore, the host and producer of this show for the Western A. Price Foundation. Now for our review. KimmyLu1 had this to say. “I have been following this show for several years now. Absolutely wonderful. The show is filled with such an abundance of facts and amazing guests. I have so much respect for Dr. Tom Cowan and I have been following his work for several years now as well. It’s such a great episode. Thank you to Dr. Tom for telling us the way it is and speaking truths. Thank you Weston A Price Foundation for all your work.”

KimmyLu1, it is our pleasure. Thank you for your review. If you would like to leave us a review, you might hear your own review. Shout it out on this show. Go to ratings and reviews at Apple Podcasts and give us as many stars as you like and tell the world why you enjoy the show. Thank you so much for tuning in. Stay well, and remember to keep your feet on the ground and your face to the sun.

Important Links

About Ronnie Cummins

Ronnie Cummins was the co-founder and International Director of the Organic Consumers Association (OCA) and its Mexico affiliate Via Organica.

OCA is a non-profit, U.S. based network of two million consumers, dedicated to safeguarding organic standards and promoting a healthy, just, and sustainable system of agriculture and commerce. The OCA’s primary strategy is to work on national and global campaigns promoting health, justice, and sustainability that integrate public education, marketplace pressure, media work, litigation, and grassroots lobbying.

Cummins was active as a writer and activist since the 1960s, with extensive experience in public education, grassroots mobilization, and marketplace pressure campaigns. Over the past two decades he served as director of US and international campaigns dealing with sustainable agriculture issues including food safety, genetic engineering, factory farming, and global warming. From 1992-98, Cummins served as a campaign director for the Foundation on Economic Trends in Washington, D.C. In 1998, Cummins co-founded the Organic Consumers Association, the largest network of organic consumers in the USA. In 2009 Cummins founded Via Organica, a network of organic consumers and farmers based in Mexico City and San Miguel de Allende, Guanajuato. Cummins is a frequent lecturer, both in the US and abroad as well as a regular contributor to online publications such as Organic Bytes, Common Dreams, Truthout, Huffington Post, and Nation of Change.

Cummins published hundreds of articles in the alternative and mainstream press. He was also the author of a series of children’s books called “Children of the World,” and also “Genetically Engineered Food: A Self-Defense Guide for Consumers” (Second Revised Edition Marlowe & Company 2004). Cummins passed away in April 2023.

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