Holographic Blood: The Surprising Way Your Blood Communicates The State Of Your Health With Adam And Josh Bigelsen

What if your body was trying to tell you something about your state of health…through your blood? And not just through blood tests or “live blood analysis” but via a holographic image?! Adam and Josh Bigelsen are carrying on the important work of their father, Harvey Bigelsen, the author of “Holographic Blood” and “Doctors are More Harmful than Germs”.

Today they help us wrap our head around the message(s) that our bodies want to communicate to us. They explain the patterns that the blood uses to tell us about our health. They also go over the progression of disease and how important it is to read the body’s messages… and how you can you do so with or without a dark field microscopy instrument.

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Episode Transcript

Within the below transcript the bolded text is Hilda Labrada Gore and the regular text is Adam And Josh Bigelsen.

Does our blood have something to communicate to us about the state of our health? What if it could show us a picture of exactly what was going wrong in the body? This is episode 523 and our guests are Adam and Josh Bigelsen, the sons of Dr. Harvey Bigelsen, a pioneer in the world of holistic medicine and the author of Holographic Blood. Adam and Josh are international known Speakers and Educators for the Bigelsen Academy.

They explain in layman’s terms how blood can be the best health diagnostic tool and how when it is analyzed through a dark field microscopy lenses. It can reveal exactly what conditions are causing poor health. They explain also how their father, a surgeon, was skeptical at first about the blood’s ability to communicate in this holographic manner and how Harvey came to understand the patterns and use this analysis could have and has helped countless patients as a result.

Josh and Adam also help us understand the patterns and progression of disease and how you don’t even need a microscope to understand what is leading to poor health and how to help the body thrive and to lead a life free of disease. Before we get into the conversation, I want to invite you to the Wise Traditions Conference. It is the conference that nourishes and every way. It’s going to be held in Salt Lake City, October 17th to the 19th. Go to Wise Traditions to find out more and to sign up now. The speakers are always top of the line. The food is out of the world and Wise Tradition’s friendly. I hope to see you there.

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Welcome to the show, Adam and Josh.

Thanks for having us.

It’s great to be here.

Harvey Bigelsen’s Knowledge And Legacy

I’m so happy that you’re here. We want to start this conversation about blood as a diagnostic tool with the story of your father. I understand he was a surgeon. He even traveled the world when he started realizing that he learned nothing about health in medical school. That doesn’t make any sense to me, but please explain it to us.

Dad’s story is unique. He was very high functioning as an individual. His math mind is interesting and crazy. He’s a very numbers-oriented. He was an eye surgeon, and a trauma surgeon in Vietnam, and he wanted to help people. He saw some interesting things in Vietnam that made him questions government. He went to medical school and he asked about a questions. They just kept telling him to read the book and his response was, “I think the book is wrong.”

He’s stuck with things to the point where he became a pioneer. The work we do with the blood, there was a woman who did this stuff in his office for a year. He didn’t believe it. He saw it and saw it, so skeptical. He was the show-me skeptic. Not the jerk static, but he saw the patterns and got involved. He was thrilled. The crash course in his history as time went on, Arizona was the first state that had a law that separated the American Medical Association from the Homeopathic Medical Association. Our father wrote that law.

He literally changed medicine in the United States. He created the American Holistic Medical Association where the AMA had no jurisdiction over them. Our father gave out the first homeopathic medical licenses in the United States. If you’ve ever met a homeopathic medical doctor, they owe their experience to our father. They would not be doing what they’re doing if it wasn’t for our dad.

Why did he want those separated?

The AMA does not have any idea what we do. Why should they have jurisdiction over us? He’s got a book called Medical Conspiracy in America. We don’t push the conspiracy stuff anymore because it’s very interesting until it happens to you. When you see the history of the American Medical Association and what they’ve done, there’s a lot of awesome things that have been put by the wayside so we can be involved in a system that doesn’t work.

Dad saw something different. He helped people. He got results with things that no one had ever gotten results with before. It was very simple to him. He wanted people to get the health care they deserved. He wanted to educate people and empower them so they can take charge of their health care instead of giving your power to a doctor who was trained by a system that doesn’t work.

Why should a medical doctor have any say over what an acupuncture does when they don’t understand acupuncture? Have any say over homeopath but don’t understand homeopathy. It broke up the bonopoly for the time being anyways.

It’s fascinating to me that one of the subtitles of your father’s books is How Surgery Can Be Hazardous to Your Health And What to Do About It, when he was a surgeon.

The blood is very straightforward. If you understand how to recognize its patterns, it will show your emotional components and the physical aspects affecting the energetic.

Yes, and that book was great, Doctors Are More Harmful Than Germs. It did not make him a lot of friends in the medical world. That’s for sure, but what he realized was patterns. What he saw was Western medicine, the Germ theory of disease has been 100-year failure. It’s a theory. They haven’t found the cause or cure of one chronic disease in over 100 years.

There’s always all this fight for the cure and breast cancer awareness and all these things, but why haven’t we made any traction in those fields?

We’re worse off than we were 100 years ago. It is funny because, “Health is simple,” dad would say, but people are complicated. The system works perfectly for those that created. It is one thing, but your grandma knew what to do. Chicken soup with the main ingredient is love or things like that. We are very science-based, even though science sounds like a dirty word. We’re very objective with what we do but we border on this area very woowe-woowe because there’s some interesting solid things to that experience.

What Is Holographic Blood

Let’s talk about the science bit first. Your father’s book Holographic Blood, which I’ve been reading is fascinating but also world upturning because even the subtitle is a new dimension in medicine explain. Explain to us even what this term means holographic blood.

If you go to your acupuncturist or your regulated practitioner. They’re going to look at your eye, your tongue, your ear, and your foot. What you’re looking at is holograms. A hologram is energy bounces off a disturbance field. We get an imprint of that disturbance field. It’s very similar to echolocation, the bats, the duff. They throw out that energy. It hits the disturbance field and they get imprint of it and they can move around it. That exactly what a hologram is.

You don’t need a microscope to see the hologram. It just gives us a very different visual view into the person. The way our microscope works is its put the beams. A normal microscope, the light goes right through the actual source where our splits the beams and helps create the actual hologram. The holograms are not physically present in the blood. We see these structures that are much bigger than a red cell.

This is where a lot of my prospects go wrong, only one cell can move through a capillary at a time. If this big structure was in your blood like we’re seeing, they would have had a stroke and died. Their holographic images. Dad was very left brain. He was Dr. Spock up there. He started with his teacher. She started showing him these patterns that he didn’t believe it. These images he was seeing would match the anatomy book.

Not only that. Those images he was seeing were directly related to the root cause. Root cause gets thrown around so flippantly these days. The root cause is not your germ. It’s not the government attacking you. The root cause is something that’s going on inside of you internally. That was created initially by the motion but that’s a story for maybe later on. The blood will show these images and then you have to put the puzzle pieces together. Why am I seeing these images? You have to match the person.

Is this what the woman and his office was doing? Did she have this split beam microscope? She’s started bringing to your father’s attention to look at these patterns. Why was he dismissive of it at first? Why might someone be dismissive of it at first?

It’s a great story. The first time he ever saw live blood was with Gaston Naessens, who was this incredible microscopist in Canada. He saw these moving particles. He was never taught to look at the blood live while he was in medical school. They stay in the blood and fix it for mentality. What he saw, he got chills. His first teacher comes in and his first teacher was a German teacher who was living on an Indian reservation.

He did the microscope, so dad brings him into the clinic and he starts doing these wild things with patients. Now he is very secretive. Dad would have to go over his reports after the guy left the office. As this guy leaves, this new person walks in the door and says, “I am here.” She’s this little four-and-a-half-foot redhead with a cape on and a diamond and crusted cigarette holder, a caricature. He just wants to learn the microscope.

He’s sitting with the client and she’s coaching him. He’s looking at the blood. He has no idea what he’s looking. He’s like, “You have a problem with the kidneys. You have a problem in the lungs.” He’s just guessing and she’s coaching him. Finally, he guessed right and she do that. One day, she asked the client as she’s looking at the microscope, “When did you break your arm?” The client says, “I didn’t tell you I broke my arm. How did you know that?” Dad’s freaked out.

He looks in the microscope and there’s a perfect image of the broken arm in there and his left brain can’t comprehend this. She does this over and over again for a year. He’s realized that what she’s seeing is what the body is concerned about. This is where the body wants attention and as he started to work on what those holographic images are showing, the person was starting to get better.

I’ll jump in real quick, Josh. A simple example, too. We’ve had people come to us with the kidney and the heart problems. They’ve been to all the specialists around the world and no one can figure anything out. Dad looks at the blood and doesn’t see that the heart is the issue. He sees that the structure is out of alignment. They’re not having a heart problem. The structures out of alignment putting pressure on the heart. The heart problem is the result. It’s not the cause.

Dad sees these things and starts to seize the body and the blood. He sends him to the osteopath, the body worker. It aligns the body and the heart problem goes away. I’ll tell you this, too, Hilda, real quick. As far as science is concerned, Josh and I were in Spain. We did a big lecture and at one point, a known person on the stage with us says, “We need to be scientists like the Bigelsen’s” I had the translator earpiece in my ear and I said, “Did he just call us scientists.” The translator said, “Yes.”

Wise Traditions | Adam And Josh Bigelsen | Blood — Holographic Blood: A New Dimension in Medicine

What he said though was we have a method that is replicable. We have seen patterns over years. What dad, didn’t believe what this woman was doing for a year. He started to get into it and started to work with it but even he would say to people, “If you want to learn this, you look at the blood and the person. If you have a good day, you look at your blood. If you have a bad day, you look at your blood. You break your foot, you look at your blood, but don’t you dare start telling people what you think until you’ve done this observed for a year at least.

He saw the value of the time it took for him to understand these images that the blood was giving and through this special microscope.

It’s all about patterns. He saw patterns. What we’ve done for people reading, Josh and I say things that are things you’ve never heard. We say things that are the exact opposite of what you’ve heard, but the reality is we do not talk about what we think and we share what we know from repeated experience.

Addressing Disease And Discomfort

If what you’re saying is possible, if there could be this microscope that has a special ability to detect these Holograms in the blood or these images. I almost picture like a movie screen and there’s something being conveyed there. You look at that and you can figure out what the root cause in the true meaning of the word. The root cause of the issue in the patient is this could transform everything. Half the time, Adam and Josh, I feel like we’re just guessing at what’s going wrong like, “My elbow hurts. Did I play too much tennis? Did I make the bed funny? Why that happen?” We don’t know and maybe something in us wants to tell us the real deal.

There answer is always very simple. It’s telling us what the body needs and the person intuitively knows that. You’re just tapping, and this isn’t new. This microscope has been around since the 1800s. It’s being utilized in a very different way that we’d don’t agree with these days. There’s hundreds and hundreds or maybe thousands of people use this microscope with some very interesting interpretations and we’ll leave it at that, but it’s very simple.

Usually, within a couple minutes you can figure out what the issue is. Let’s say, you were diagnosed in 2007. What was going on in 2005 to 2006? What was going on with you emotionally at that point in time? There’s usually an emotional trauma set up by a physical injury or surgery. The surgery is just a result of some emotional issue that you’re having.

The key then at that point is you don’t work on the emotion. You work on the physical to help release the emotion. The brilliance of what dad did is he put the puzzle pieces together. A lot of people talk about just the emotional or the physical part or the energetic part. We subscribe to Steiner’s four bodies. If you’re not working with all four bodies, then you’re missing huge pieces to the show.

Can you elaborate what are those four bodies? I’ve read some of his works but I’m curious. I’m trying to remember them.

It’s the physical body, energetic, emotional, and spiritual. The reality is they’re all interconnected. This is our holistic integrative experience. The fact that you have a problem with your liver, could be a physical thing where the body’s out of alignment putting pressure on the liver. Energy from the teeth with the meridians going through the teeth, could be something going on root canal, mercury or something on the meridian that affects the energy of the organ. It could also be angry issues affecting the organ. It can also be the body putting the structure and putting pressure on the liver which then affects energies of the teeth and then affects your emotional experience as well. This is the holistic quantum experience for us.

Does the blood show which of the four it is or is there still some tapping into the intuition that we need to do to understand what’s going on?

The blood is very straightforward. If you understand how to recognize the patterns and you understand your data, it’s straightforward. It will show us the emotional components. It will show us the physical that’s affecting the energetic. The spirit is a different story. We might be seeing the spirit in the blood, but we can’t tell you for sure on that one. That’s a study for another day. There’s a deeper story behind that but we know, at least, we’re seeing three of the four bodies in the blood, and there’s potential that we are seeing the fourth body there as well.

I’ll tell you this, too. The one quick example of my girlfriend. Anna’s got a friend in Spain. She’s in her 40s. They wanted to do hip replacement on her. Something’s wrong with the hip. A 40 years old is too young for hip replacement. She’s got good friends. She’s been to body workers and all kinds of people. Nothing stays sustainable. We look at the blood. What do we see? We see the hip. We see a scar and then we see a cervix.

We’re putting puzzle pieces together. She had a procedure on the cervix that created a scar. That scar is created the stream pattern and it’s pulling the hip out of alignment. We work with the scar. We release the scar tissue, then the body is not pulled anymore. We align the body and two years later, the woman is walking 10-miles a day and has no hip surgery in her future. It’s putting these pieces to the puzzle together.

When your father was explaining almost a progression of the body, how we start getting signals of, let’s say discomfort then later it turns into inflammation and how it leads to ultimately death, but how we can intervene, if we catch it early enough. Can you talk to us a little bit about that?

This gets into homotoxicology. Homotoxicology is a word. There’s three different things that Josh and I talked about that nobody has heard of and this is a big deal. Homotoxicology has a chart. It talks about the pattern and progressions of disease. There have been nobel prizes won with work based on this chart. Number one, the toxin interests the body, so the body wants to excrete. This is normal. We cough, pee, puke, barf, and poop. Diarrhea is always. This is normal. At this point, we leave things be but then if things don’t get out then inflammation comes in.

The body creates a very specific bacteria for a very specific job. There are no good or bad bacteria.

Inflammation is stage two. This is now bacterial in nature. We are creating the bacteria within us to help push things out. Inflammation is a hot topic. Inflammation is how we heal. However, if the inflammation becomes trapped, things back up and we become inflamed. Now things deposit. This is the third stage deposition. Things can’t get out. The body’s trying to inflame and get things out and not working. Things will deposit wherever you are weakest. Grief that goes to the lungs. Surgeries goes towards scars and things like this.

Things deposit into the body, and now you’re molding. It’s fungal. We have this biological division of, can we start to deal with this or not? When you get into deposition, you start to need some interventions. If it’s deposits, then it impregnates in the tissue, fourth stage and things degenerate and dedifferentiate. The sixth stage is your cancers. It’s a very easy progression for us to see how cancer happens. Dad was very famous for his cancer work. I heard if you look up cancer doctors and sustainable cancer cures, our father is one of two people that comes up. We know many places in Mexico cures cancer. It’s cool. People cure cancer in Mexico all the time, but then years later, you have a different cancer.

They don’t care cancer. They have a remission. Remission means you did not fix the actual cause of the cancer in the first place. A lot of things will kill the cancer, but if you don’t fix why the cancer was there, it’s going to come right back.

I read a book where a fellow was describing and I think it was Corinne. He was talking about how it’s like taking trash out. Let’s say a surgeon removes a tumor and he’s taking the trash out of your body. Let’s say everything that was accumulating there, but what its source was never identified. It’s going to be deposited somewhere else.

This is the tumor as your body deposing/isolating. This is a great job. The body is amazing, what it can do. Sometimes, you got a tumor. You got to cut it off. When dad was working with cancer, he wasn’t Eastern and Western. He was a combination of integrative. He would strengthen the body naturally while they would do small doses of chemo or radiation to go for the cancer.

What To Gain From Fungus

Occasionally, he would use radiation because he knows how to protect the body from the radiation. Chemotherapy is a straight up poison and the theory behind it is that they help a kills the cancer before the person dies. That is the theory behind it. In the hard cases, he would use these small doses of radiation right into the tumor while he protected the body with things like oxygen work, ozone work, cell therapy, and animal proteins to strengthen those bones, so they could deal with it and things like that. In those hard cases, he knows how to protect the body from the actual radiation itself. He came about it from a bit of a different view. I need to take a step back at it real quick and explain morphism because the bacterial fungal phases, but I don’t know if you want to talk about.

I can do a quick on this.

It’s because I don’t do it short.

We’re very good at a two-hour lectures. We’re learning.

This is the foundation for our work.

Yes, I want to hear more.

Dad looked at the blood with Gaston Naessens’, the famous physicist. He sees these little things moving around in the blood. Dad had never seen that because Western medicine does not look at the live blood, so he wants to know. These little things, the symbiotes, the microzymes, the biomes, as Wilhelm Reich called them. This is our life force. This is our Chi and our Prana. These little things never die. They help us to create who we are and help us to decompose.

Gaston Naessens’s isolated one and injected it into a dead rat muscle, and 30 years later that muscle was alive in a jar. Barlando and Mom saw it. Multiple people have seen this. Dr. Frankenstein was alive and well living in Canada. Now, dad comes back to the states. He was a third doctor in US history to every look at the blood live. Royal Rife, Virginia Livingston-Wheeler and her father, more experience than anybody.

If you folks know someone else, we’d love to talk to them. However, these little guys will morph and change into bacteria and fungus due to this process of pleomorphism based on our terrain. The betain becomes more acidic. pH is change or alkaline, and these are the guys will change into bacteria into fungus to help us.

Before you talked about this division, when is it either the body is going to help us survive, which it does 24 hours a day and seven days a week, or there’s a point where the body says, “It’s time to recycle.” This for us is the cancers. The six stage of that homotoxicology chart. It’s a mold. It needs a low oxygen content experience and needs certain pH environment. If you have moldy cheese, you cut the cheese out of the mold and three days later, you got mold all over the cheese because it’s bad cheese.

Still, the mold is not the problem. The mold is what’s there trying to clean up your terrain. If we don’t fix it, then the mold it’s going to help you decompose so it can create new life. It’s important to note this that the body creates a very specific bacteria for a very specific job. There are no good and bad bacteria. There’s no such thing as a pathogen. The bacteria is designed to do a very specific thing. Pathogen just means out of balance.

We want balance there. The body creates a specific bacterium. What’s the bacteria do? It goes to clean up the garbage and then the white product of the bacteria is nutrients for your body. The farmers know this. There’s always nutrients in the soil. If you don’t have microbiology to process the nutrients, the nutrients are bound on the soil. The same exact thing goes in our body. The bacteria is cleaning the soil and excreting nutrients for us.

Nothing is wasted in nature. We know it because the manure fertilizes the soil. What we think of is waste is providing nutrients just as your suggesting.

Now, if we don’t fix the stagnation, the body can continue to shift. Our pH will continue to change and then the bacterial morph into a fungus. Now we’re going from acute issues to a chronic issue. The fungus is still trying to clean. It’s like if you look at plants that are more bacterial nature. They need more bacterial nutrients and trees need more fungal. You’ve got new and old growth. The same thing in our bodies. The bacterial issue is acute and then a chronic issue is more fungal. The beauty is it can all be reversed. If you fix the stagnation, our pH is balance out. The fungus goes back into a bacteria, and then back into healthy microzyme to create whatever life is needed in the terrain.

Let me piggyback in this real quick as Josh mentioned this fungus. We know about Paul Stamets. He did an experiment where he put mushrooms on an oil spill. The mushrooms extracted toxicity from the soil and convert it to organic matter. This is where we are very much into the terrain. We are not separate from nature. Now we have fungus in the body. Is it extracting toxicity from our soil and converting it to organic matter? It is. This is what nature does and we’re a part of nature. We never did detoxes and cleanses. We’re not here to kill that stuff. You’re going to kill all your candida. There’s food for it. It’s doing a job. You kill it all and then your root causes still there.

Let’s say someone has a toe fungus. They’re adding this ointment and doing all these things to get rid of that fungus. They want the window clean when the room inside the house is a mess. You clean the window, but there’s still something going on in the inside. That’s what we’re missing.

This is were homotoxicology shows. If you’re pushing that symptom back into the body, you’re creating a deeper issue. If you cured your toe fungus, but every single one of those wants to get rid of toefungus causes liver issues. The liver is cleaning out that garbage. Now you’re pressing that garbage back in the system. You’re starting to have a deeper issue but that topical ointment you put on their shows there’s a positive that it worked. It doesn’t care that you have much more serious issues down the line.

This is funny. Dad did a radio show and he was talking to the interviewer. The guys says, “You don’t believe Western medicine has cured anyone.” He said, “No.” He said, “Can we take callers who think they’ve been cured by Western medicine?” Dad said, “Sure.” By the end of the show, not one of those callers had been cured by Western medicine.

The one caller was like, “My brother went in for this and that. He was treated by Western medicine. What happened was the guy died.” Dad was like, “Why are you calling then?” The treatment was a success but the patient died.

This is all so where we see antibiotics. For us, something’s going on, “I took the antibiotics and I got better.” No, you didn’t. You pushed that crap deeper and now you’re going to get something worse going on. You masked the symptom is all you did.

What’s brilliant about the body is antibiotics don’t kill anything. What the body does is it morphs and changes into a while article forms the antibiotic doesn’t recognize. It’s pushing the bacteria more into a deeper stage. Maybe into a fungal phase. That antibiotic isn’t targeting that.

I see. It’s like it goes incognito in a way. It slips past the radar of the antibiotic but it’s still in there doing some damage. This is interesting because a friend of mine her son had some pneumonia or some pulmonary issue. He went through four courses of antibiotics until it resolved. Maybe like you’re suggesting all of those antibiotics might have done some apparent solution but it didn’t get to the root issue.

It got rid of those symptoms but you can bet dollars down on the line there’s going to be some heavier symptoms that are rise. It might not be in a few days or a few months. Down the line, what it’s done is push that symptom deeper down on the body. There’s a higher valence being created and it might be that it comes back something much more serious in the future. Not always. Dad always said sometimes the body heals and spite of the treatments it receives.

In spite of, I love that.

It works with the homotoxicology, too, Hilda. If you think about coughing, the lungs. We cough to get something out but then we take cough syrup, then we have some bronchitis. We do something else, then we have chronic bronchitis. Eventually we get emphysema. You’re taking a supplement or a pharmaceutical to push your symptoms down then it goes deeper. You take another pharmaceutical and it pushes it deeper. The average American is on 2 to 4 pharmaceuticals. The homotoxicology chart stage six is cancer. Push 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, cancer. One in three Americans say they’re going to get cancer.

We are part of nature. We are not separate from it.

Yes, us as human beings, and then I’m thinking of pets, too. I have a dog and I’m often in the dog park. This dog and that dog all have cancer or issues with their teeth. I’m like, “What’s Happening?” Whatever’s happening to the dogs is happening to us as well. We’re looking for the easy fix and we’re not getting to the root cause of the problem.

The dogs are interesting because K9 cancer is newer within the last few decades. What we see is dogs are very sympathetic. If you’re sad, they don’t want you to be. Dogs take on our crap. I had someone that went through this. I’m convinced if you know anyone who’s dog died of cancer. If that person did not have that dog, that person would have gotten the cancer.

We’ve seen cases where the person’s cancer goes away and the dog dies of cancer. That’s the quantum entanglement right there. We’re all connected. We are all connected. Animals don’t let their ego get in the way. They’re unconditional love right there. That’s the beauty of nature and that’s where we would do well to remember that we are part of nature and we’re not separate from it.

How To Get Holographic Blood

I said that all the time, we’re a part of nature and not meant to be a part from it. I want to back up for just a minute because let’s say someone’s reading and they’re like, “I want to get to the root cause.” Where the heck did they find someone who can do this live blood analysis to the degree that you’re describing so that they can get those holographic images to have an idea of what’s happening on a deeper level?

Good question. Live blood analysis has a similar microscope. It is not what we do. Live blood analysis is a brand. That’s all known as Nutritional Microscopy. This is confusing for people.

It’s confusing for me apparently.

We analyze the blood live but we do not do live blood analysis. Does that make sense? Live blood analysis, nutritional microscopy, looking at your blood, all kinds of parasites, symptoms, and supplements. These days supplements are treating the leaves on the tree. We’ve seen things change with the naturopathic schools and they’re becoming green paths. They’re treating symptoms with natural substances. We do not do live blood analysis. You can see we get a little weird about this. If anyone’s doing it, don’t take this personally or not, is very inconsistent work.

I got confused because you were saying that you analyze the blood but it’s not the same as this particular almost brand, the live blood analysis.

Very similar images and very different interpretation philosophy.

Very different interpretations. People are taking a two-day workshop, going, diagnosing, and making conclusions based on somebody else’s work. There’s a long story behind it, but it is not something we encourage. If live cell people want to learn, they have to understand the philosophy first so they bypass the fact that germs there to assist us in a lot of ways. The philosophy behind why they’re looking into the microscope is wrong. The conclusions are then going to be wrong.

They’re looking for like, “Where is the enemies?” It’s still that Western mindset. We’re a battleground. The body is a battleground and we’re going to attack whatever is wrong and get rid of it. You all see all of the little organisms as on our side and their present because they’re helping and they can help us as a pose to trying to wipe them out.

Nothing in nature is anti. It’s all symbiotic. We follow Darwin who was right on a lot of things, but he talks about survival the fittest. “I’m stronger than you, so I win.” We have wars on drugs, cancer, viruses, and terrorism. None of that has been successful. Its predecessor was Lamarck, who preached everything evolved through symbiosis. The animal eats the plants. The plant has to evolve. Now, the animal has to evolve along with the plant.

This is how we evolved. Not through antagonism. The herb you’re putting into your body is never ever going to be antibacterial. It’s going to be pro-bacterial. It’s never going to be antifungal. We’ve heard somebody say he loves mushrooms because they’re antifungal properties. It’s like, do you listen to what you just said? Nothing in nature is anti. It is symbiotic and that is the way plant medicine works. It is pro-bacteria, pro-fungal, and pro-inflammatory.

I love that distinction and I’m glad you made it because I don’t like to be anti-things myself. I like to be pro things. It’s nice to know that nature’s on the same page.

If words are power, which we learned from Dr. Motto. If you’re taking something natural and calling it anti, you’re weakening the energy of that experience.

Before you even put it into your body, if you’re calling that plant, anti-bacterial. You’re weakening energy of that plant before you even put it into your body.

Very profound.

We got a lot of people like to argue about that one.

I believe it because our words are very powerful and this is where I see you overlapping somewhat with German new medicine and other approaches that say, “It’s not just the physical that’s making a sick. It could be environmental or relational or related to a number of things.” The fact that we spend so much time indoors has disconnected us from nature to a degree that is literally leading to disease. We don’t feel comfortable anymore because we’re in these like little cage spaces. It’s very odd.

We’ve lost our connections.

It’s a safe space but it’s too sterile.

To answer your other question, too. At this point, there is no one in the world who does what we do the way we do it. We have trained a few people, but we don’t endorse any of them. It’s unfortunate of what’s going on with people in microscopes over the four years. They do take a few our course, or twelve hours. You can take a twelve hours course now, and they’re scaring the crap out of people into unnecessary treatments. There’s no fear in what we do. It’s all information. The body’s trying to help you.

Cancers are very real diagnosis. Dad had real success with it, depending on the person. He said, “Cancer is easy. Health is easy. People are complicated.” We make life much more complicated than we need to. If you go to our website Bigelsen Academy, we do distance consultations. In the United States, we used to do them in Spain. We’re working on getting microscopes to other places, which is another story, too. At some point where training technicians as soon as we get the right microscopes.

You can order a distance consultation in the states. If you’re in Mexico, I can do something. We send you the slide kit and instructions on how to put the blood on the slide. Get it back to us within 24 or s36 hours. Josh can read the blood, create the report and we get on explain to you what’s going on. We educate and empower you. We will give you links. We’ll tell you the type of person that has helped other people in your similar circumstances. Since we’re not doctors, we have to use interesting language, but we guide people, we educate, and we tell them.

All we do is translate what their blood is telling them. Their blood is saying, “Arm. Scars.” We get them to the right person and then things start to change. Josh and I educate. We love it. We do some training courses and we’re teaching the philosophy and theory behind what we do. We have our first ever blood basic course where we’re teaching some of the blood again but you need to take one of our thirteen-week courses first before we think about teaching you.

Unfortunately, people have taken our work and done ridiculous things. You seen microscope images with people making total incorrect guesses and scaring people into ridiculousness. We love teaching. It’s the right people that come our way. For people reading, when we say certain things and it resonates. There’s something powerful there. You do not need to do this with us forever. Josh and I rarely look at our blood because we understand what’s happening. It makes perfect sense to us. I don’t get sick unless I want to. I don’t know that I’ve ever taken a pharmaceutical that I can remember.

What we try to do is educate people so they don’t get sick in the first place.

That’s the best thing, preventive.

What exists in nature does not exist in a pill bottle. Whether it’s a pharmaceutical or a supplement. Sometimes, the right supplement can help give you a boost. How many people do you know that take vitamin C every day and haven’t eaten orange in four years? You think there’s more than vitamin C in an orange? There is. It’s a balance. We’ll direct them. We don’t endorse and recommend supplements. People want to get some vitamins. Look at your food source by Nourishing Traditions.

The only book that that ever recommended are diet was Nourishing Traditions because everybody likes to yell and scream about diet. How do they know what’s best for me? Nourishing Traditions is education. It’s a huge part of the education process. Get your vitamins from your food if you can. If not, find out the source of your food. It’s very simplistic food. Food can be medicine and unfortunately, a lot of times these days, it’s the exact opposite, but it’s education. We want to educate people on how the body works. Give them tips on how to deal with that and, hopefully, they’re not going to get sick in the first place. If they do, they’re going to have some resources on how to help that situation.

Disease happens in stagnation. Nothing in nature evolves in isolation.

On a side note, one reason I love Sally’s book Nourishing Traditions is because the wisdom was from all over the world. It wasn’t just from one person. It wasn’t even from Sally. It was from these people who were eating foods. She was highlighting them even as she was sharing recipes about how to nourish ourselves as our ancestors did in different parts of the planet. It was fascinating. I’m so glad to hear that your dad encouraged that approach because some people think, “I need to eat the Mediterranean diet or paleo or keto or whatever.” It’s like, let’s pay attention to what our body wants then nourish it in that way.

Eat from your environment. I’m not probably supposed to be living off of well in California.

These are patterns, too, Hilda that dad saw. He noticed when people came to the United States and they brought all these different foods. We had new health issues. If you come visit me in Mexico, you’re going to get Montezuma’s Revenge. Is it bad? No, your body is adapting. That’s just the way it goes.

It’s not because the food is bad. It’s because you’re adapting to new food. It takes the body a few days to adapt to that.

It’s so interesting about the travel thing, too. I was going to say we want to stay protected and I see people on planes using hand sanitizer all over the place. It’s like they’re trying to be a bubble but that’s not how nature works.

No, it’s an interaction. If we’re guarding ourselves and doing what Reich would call stress and armoring, we’re not only blocking an inflow. We’re blocking our outflow as well. If we’re hiding under our ferriday cage all day long because we’re afraid we have been bombarded by everything. There is no exchange of energy right there. Disease happens in stagnation. Nothing in nature evolves in isolation.

It’s interesting, Josh, too, because my girlfriend, Hilda is a research scientist. Very famous in Europe, and Spain. As she was working in laboratory, the woman who worked in the sterile room, that one room where there’s nothing. That woman was sick all the time. There’s nothing there to stimulate antibacterial. Kids should fall down and eat dirt when their children. We should all do that. “There’s your supplement, guys. Go eat some dirt.” These are the things that doesn’t kill us that make us stronger. The antibacterial soap, when those kids get sick, they get sick for a much longer period of time because their body’s not accustomed to dealing with that stuff. It’s very simple for us.

Dad says when medicine focuses on killing bacteria, it’s leaving a weakened body without its workers to do the job to clean up the terrain.

Can you repeat that, Josh?

When medicine focus is on killing bacteria, we’re leaving the body in a weakened state without the tools to regenerate and heal.

Message To Naysayers

You folks have given me so much food for thought, I want to see if we can do a part two, especially to talk about the patterns of disease that are seen in the holographic blood images, and maybe even to challenge a little bit more your paradigm, though. I have to say, I agree with quite a bit of it, but that reminds me, I have two questions as we close out. One is some skeptic might say, “Josh and Adam, they say they’re the only ones that can analyze the blood this way because they’re just trying to make money.” What do you say to people who are like, “These men are driven by their own desire to build their own kingdom?”

Let me tell you, I moved to Mexico because I cannot afford to live in the United States. I have no money, people. If this is what we’re doing, it’s not working for us.

When you listen to us lecture, we talk people out of doing consults all the time because the answer is that simple. The little guys got a question. It’s like, “It’s obvious, your parents got divorced with the age of twelve and then they took your appendix out. Go to your osteopath.” We have a very terrible business model because we only look at the blood once if we need to. The person goes on their way and has their path that they need to follow. We’re there to support that, but these days as much as the blood is awesome and we’d love to sell consults. It’s more about the education process

Apparently, it’s not money that’s driving you. It is a desire to educate people about what their bodies are capable of, which sounds a lot to me the legacy your father was also imparting.

He was a rich eye surgeon and was near suicidal. He had all the money he’d ever wanted and he said, “This is not the way things go.” We have learned the difference between being rich and living rich and we live very rich. I’d like to try being rich, because I’m curious. We have such needs. I have need for people with marketing and I can’t afford it.

We have need for microscopes but they’re expensive. Our microscopes, if you guys are looking for these dark field microscopes, don’t pay less than $4,000 because you can get a piece of crap. We’re working with a company to develop microscopes and they said if you buy twenty then we’ll do it. I don’t have $80,000. People can say that if they want to. Do you want to see my bank account? There’s nothing there.

You’re very transparent.

People find us. The one thing we don’t like to do is we don’t preach fear. One of the greatest things the microscope does for us is it takes the fear of the unknown out of the person. You’re right, doctors are guessing. Unfortunately, the traditional alternative practitioner is just as bad these days. You’ve got acupuncture, it’s giving parasite cleanses. It goes against the very foundation of Eastern philosophy. They’re getting fewer and farther between. We just try to educate and empower. The blood gives us a very unique tool. You do not need it to figure out the issue. This just makes it very simple for us.

The right osteopath will put their hands on you and feel the flow right there. The right acupuncture is going to give you a supplement based on your constitution. Not on treating the symptoms. There are people who can do this. We would love to drum up business and get some consultations and things like that but health is that simple that a lot of people don’t need it.

The most important thing though is the philosophy. If you believe that we’re being attacked all the time, that is going to leave you on a healthy state. We have found that people want to be the victim sometimes. They want to live in fear, and those people aren’t ready for us. We don’t preach any of that. There’s no such thing as false hope. You get busy living or you get busy dying, and it’s all a process. That’s what we’re here to do. We’re here to educate and empower people so they can take charge of their own health care.

Preaching accountability. Hold yourself accountable. I love these patterns. It would be cool and what would be awesome is read the book and then we’ll come on again. We can answer some questions. I saw a meme or something where someone said, “In October, we have a candy holiday. In November, we have an eating food and family, drama holiday. In December, we have another party drunk ridiculous holiday and then we have the flu season.”

We ask ourselves. It’s called a flu season, which is also words and spells put over us by the media like, it’s cold and flu season. We didn’t have cold and flu season when I was growing up. It was summer, spring, winter, and fall.

Seasons adapt. Why wouldn’t we? The philosophy gets this. We have a few days where the mucous membranes get irritated. We create snot to soothe the weakest membrane. That’s our adaptation. That’s the body adapting.

Adam And Josh’s Tip To Improve Health

There’s so much more to pursue. I will finish this book and I hope to have you on again. Now, I want to post you all the question I love to pose at the end of every show. If the reader could only do one thing because we always recommend that they take one step in the right direction to improve their health. What would you recommend that they do?

The one thing that is more important than anything. The first thing is you. You are more important than anyone in your world. On the airplane, if you put the kid’s air mask on first, then you may die and the child may not have a mother. You take care of yourself first. Dad had a guy. He was a cancer patient of his that said to him he did documentaries. He said, “Doc, what do we do to avoid these things like cancer?” He said,” The thing that will change your blood faster than anything and your pH faster than anything is joy.”

I knew you were going to say that. I was thinking joy.

It’s so important for our health, Hilda. You feed your vibration and things change. We’re all afraid of everything. We’re confused. When life gets difficult for me, I play my damn guitar. I play my drums. I go out and take a walk. This is a big deal health is you’ve earned it or joy you’ve earned it. You deserve it and it’s good for your health.

I love it. What would you add to that Josh?

The same thing. What makes you happy, though is different for everybody else. Only because it makes you happy, don’t go pushed on others. For me, birds. I go outside and hang out with the birds. That makes me happy. We had people do our list of joy. There was always something on that list you could do each day and it’s different for everybody. It’s simple, but health is very simple. Find that joy and embrace it.

Dad’s conclusion with cancers and chronic disease was it was 1,000% triggered emotionally. We are emotional beings. Joy is very important. Fear changes the pH. That’s not a good thing. Stress changes the pH. We need a balance and joy is important.

The thing that will change your blood and pH level faster than anything is joy.

Balance your pH. It’s not a supplement. It is Joy.

A good word to end on, gentlemen. I am so thankful for you and I hope we get to talk again on behalf of the Weston A. Price Foundation. Thank you so much for your time.

Honor to be on here.

Thank you.

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Our guest were Adam and Josh Bigelsen. Go to the website, Bigelsen Academy to learn more. I am Hilda Labrada Gore, the hosts and producer of this show on behalf of the Weston A. Price Foundation. Now for a review from Apple Podcast. Murphy Olumpus had this to say, “Phenomenal guest. A plus topic. No nonsense interviewing style, and always interesting and to the point. This is an amazing show on all things health and wellness for busy moms on the go. Thank you for diving quickly into the meat and not wasting our valuable time.”

It is my pleasure to host this show. Honestly, I am so thankful for it and I’m glad you’re benefiting, too. If you like the show, please give us a shout out, too. Go to Apple Podcast, click on ratings and reviews. Give us a bunch of stars and tell people why they should be reading, too. Thank you so much for reading, my friend. Stay well and remember to keep your feet on the ground and your face to the sun.

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The content on this show is provided for informational purposes only and is not intended to substitute for the advice provided by your doctor or other healthcare professional. It is not intended to be nor does it constitute healthcare or medical advice.

About Adam and Josh Bigelsen

Adam and Josh Bigelsen are the sons of Dr. Harvey Bigelsen who was a pioneer in the world of holistic medicine, and author of the groundbreaking books, Holographic Blood® and Doctors are More Harmful than Germs. Both brothers are international speakers, holistic wellness coaches and educators for the Bigelsen Academy. They also lecture and teach workshops.